Author Topic: Star Citizen Media Musings  (Read 300023 times)

Motto

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #510 on: January 19, 2018, 04:24:37 PM »
LOL!! he really did rage quit and deleted his account. wth?

I honestly don't know what he was expecting to find here  :shrug:

He brought back some fond memories of Serenstupidity though...

dsmart

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #511 on: January 19, 2018, 05:15:08 PM »
I honestly don't know what he was expecting to find here  :shrug:

He brought back some fond memories of Serenstupidity though...

I honestly think it was him.
Star Citizen isn't a game. It's a TV show about a bunch of characters making a game. It's basically "This is Spinal Tap" - except people think the band is real.

Spunky Munkee

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #512 on: January 19, 2018, 05:29:25 PM »
Has anyone noticed that NONE of the heavy hitting top litigators in the country are rendering opinions in the courthouse of YouTube?

The people who actually WIN these cases would never reveal anything here, for free.

Why don't we reserve judgement until the REAL PROFESSIONALS do their thing and win lose or settle.

While some of the purported lawyers opinions may have some merit they don't have the whole story thus their opinions are based upon the tip of the iceberg. In addition, their opinions may be skewered.

The opinions of the remainder of the You Tube sock puppets who are shills for Croberts and the Whales are worthless as ever and should be ignored unless you need something to help you pass your bowels.

jwh1701

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #513 on: January 19, 2018, 05:43:02 PM »
Well apparently Leonard French already recanted his previous flawed opinions.

https://twitter.com/UnsafestSpace/status/954463514793578496

Leonard starts out more tepid but then definitely has an undertone still towards CIG.


31:00 Shows Chris lied about working on the game for a year before the kickstarter, no one blinks an eye.

33:00 Completely still disagrees with Crytek, says cig can use any engine to make the game.

35:20 still says crytek is not interpreting 2.4 correctly

41:47 says skadden is using double speak from what I can gather, could be wrong

45:07 skadden doesn't understand copyright infringement

48:08 states the breaches are not big, he thinks crytek wanted more money


51:12 states cytek claims can be blown out of water depending on interpretation of the license statement above 1. / 1.1

1:01 says crytek made a 24 page gla that is ambiguous, lots of mistakes have been made

1:04:50 says good luck proving any damages

1:05:07 thinks the only solid claim is the bug fixes

1:05:25 calls bush## on copyright infringement

1:08 new term "hammer and nail case" to try and push the one game narrative

1:09 Crytek admits they do not know if CIG is using their tech

1:10:51 says they both have different interpretation of what breach a contract is. Says its not a breach of copyright if its breach of contract.

1:13:18 says its way to late for cytek to file copyright under statuary damages

1:16:44 says crytek is disingenuous going back on conflict with ortwin.

1:20 thinks judge will take this to discovery, and the lawsuit is a lot of petty stuff, says the gla is terrible


Person donated $1000 to him and will be going on John's show.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2018, 05:45:36 PM by jwh1701 »

StanTheMan

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #514 on: January 19, 2018, 10:00:43 PM »
IMO Skadden wouldnt be peppering their complaint with intent if they didn't think it had long legs.

All good fun though isnt it. ?

I remember how long the Glider v Blizzard case took re WoW and that didnt have anything like as much potential for twists and turns as this showdown.

Nice to see the Glider case (MDY Industries v Blizzard) was quoted in Skadden's reply today..I followed that for a few years with the takeaway that where there is wrongdoing (producing a bot for WoW) the law is going to take you down but on appeal not go over the top.  Now that case was akin to a photocopier manufacturer being fond guilty of copyright infringement because someone used one of their photocopiers to copy copy write protected material.  AS Derek has said he will do in this case, there were consumer interested bodies filing Amicus Briefings with this case (not that they appeared to have done much good with the original trial judge as it went to an appeal)

So will a Jury find Crytek to be in the wrong here or CRoberts ?   Hmmmm !!!!

The Judge would direct the Jury and IMHO ...they are going to see CIG as the robbers here and Crytek ( and Backers) as the injured party.

CIG would have to be mad (or have no choice other than) to take this to a trial....
« Last Edit: January 19, 2018, 10:05:54 PM by StanTheMan »

Aya Reiko

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #515 on: January 19, 2018, 11:38:55 PM »
LOL!! he really did rage quit and deleted his account. wth?
Ahhh...  And here I was about to accuse him of being another Serenstupidity alt. :saddowns: But one thing was clear, both were cut from the same Shitizen-brand cloth of denial; "Facts be damned, CRoberts is infallible."  :laugh:

Kyrt

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #516 on: January 20, 2018, 01:51:25 AM »
If you only read a firecracker, you may need some glasses. The only thing that you can get from the response is that CIG is completely, utterly and totally fucked. Any other conclusion only means that you haven't read it correctly.

CryTek countered many of the points CIG raised...to a degree.

But, end of the day, this is still coming down to how a judge is going to interpret certain key phrases and what they mean under law.

CIGs MtD was never going to succeed but that doesn't mean they won't win.

DemonInvestor

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #517 on: January 20, 2018, 02:09:08 AM »
CryTek countered many of the points CIG raised...to a degree.

But, end of the day, this is still coming down to how a judge is going to interpret certain key phrases and what they mean under law.

CIGs MtD was never going to succeed but that doesn't mean they won't win.

It's not even as simple as win/loose.
CryTek might win or loose on any point, which means we don't know what damages they can claim in the end.

Kyrt

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #518 on: January 20, 2018, 02:16:34 AM »
33:00 Completely still disagrees with Crytek, says cig can use any engine to make the game.

I think that depend son the definition of the word "exclusive".

Quote
35:20 still says crytek is not interpreting 2.4 correctly

Let's be honest here - that IS a noncompete clause. Its doubtful - IMO - that CryTek has any documentation or emails showing it to be anything else other than what it is.  That doesn't mean Skadden won't try, and on a literal reading, it could be argued that the use of promotion of Lumberyard by CIG is contrary to 2.4...

But it is, at the end of the day, a non compete clause. Even using LumberYard doesn't mean CIG is "in the business of" promoting or developing an engine.

I'd agree with French here, but as I said, that doesn't mean Skadden cannot make it mean what they want it to mean.

Quote
51:12 states cytek claims can be blown out of water depending on interpretation of the license statement above 1. / 1.1

1:01 says crytek made a 24 page gla that is ambiguous, lots of mistakes have been made

I'm not sure about that. I'm not a lawyer, but the meaning of the GLA seems pretty clear to me.

Quote
1:08 new term "hammer and nail case" to try and push the one game narrative

Exhibit 2 defines a standalone game.
S42 seems to qualify...unless you want to argue that a standalone game that is marketed and sold as a standalone game that doesn't require Star Citizen to run somehow coiunts as using the Star Citizen client.

Quote
1:09 Crytek admits they do not know if CIG is using their tech

Part of discovery. Two days to switch engine is not a plausible statement...but it could be just marketing PR. But two days isn't enough time to test and modify and replace code and assets. LY and SE both started from similar bases, but both teams were boasting about how they'd rewritten 65% or more of each engine....that's gotta be hugely divergent, especially with certain fundamental aspects changed. Then again, there are some people who have reported decompiling the code and who report some CryEngine code still present. But it doesn't only matter if the code is or is not present now - but WHEN it was switched.

More importantly is the question as to if S42 could be argued to have been developed using LY only.

Quote
1:20 thinks judge will take this to discovery, and the lawsuit is a lot of petty stuff, says the gla is terrible

Of course it is terrible. But it also depends on what supporting documentation they have. As it is, it also seems to give CIG very little power and a "plain English" reading of 2.1.2 would seem to support CryTeks assertions. The big suspect issue is the damage waiver...I'm still not sure why CryTek agreed to that.

In essence, the GLA offers CIG a very cheap engine deal with limited training and no real support, but allows CryTek to wash its hands of the project while requiring CIG to promote CryEngine (regardless of engine), improve CryEngine and share such improvements (64 bit positioning, localised physic grids, subsumption AI and the rest) with a perpetual, royalty free license and offers no effective termination clause.

To be honest, that CIG accepted a clause that required it to promote CryEngine is, to me, a fair sign they intended to use only CryEngine. As it is, even if they used Unity or something else, CryEngine would need to be promoted.

DemonInvestor

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #519 on: January 20, 2018, 02:53:07 AM »
Exhibit 2 defines a standalone game.
S42 seems to qualify...unless you want to argue that a standalone game that is marketed and sold as a standalone game that doesn't require Star Citizen to run somehow coiunts as using the Star Citizen client.

The problem is that standalone game seems to be somewhat defined by the starting through the same launcher.
One could argue against that (Total War series launched through one application, but different games), but also for it (X-Com 2 WotC, started as modules within one exe - being a add-on). Not having researched the usage of such terms in american courts, means i've no clue how they'd rule on that.

Part of discovery. Two days to switch engine is not a plausible statement...but it could be just marketing PR. But two days isn't enough time to test and modify and replace code and assets. LY and SE both started from similar bases, but both teams were boasting about how they'd rewritten 65% or more of each engine....that's gotta be hugely divergent, especially with certain fundamental aspects changed. Then again, there are some people who have reported decompiling the code and who report some CryEngine code still present. But it doesn't only matter if the code is or is not present now - but WHEN it was switched.

The question here also is how courts rule on switching between two different engines using similar source code offered under different licenses, when at least one license is trying to ensure that no similar game is made with or without the copyrighted source code within a certain timeframe.
The When question is also interesting, because CIG and CryTek agreed upon what defines initial release. And i'd guess there's a difference between changing engines before release and after release.

Spunky Munkee

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #520 on: January 20, 2018, 03:33:16 AM »
Has anyone noticed that while everybody is talking about this lawsuit nobody is talking about the failed state of the game?

That's what this is all supposed to be about. There is NO GAME.

Regardless of the outcome of this lawsuit the fact remains that this is a money pit  that has sucked up over 170 million dollars and has no end in sight. Admittedly should Crytek succeed it could hasten the demise of this sham masquerading as a game development.

Just create a kickstarter fund to buy Chris Roberts a Hot Dog cart and perhaps we will see him manage a business that matches his skill set.

jwh1701

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #521 on: January 20, 2018, 12:01:29 PM »
Not sure if this is ok to post in this thread?

Interesting write up about what happened when one developer ran out of crowd funded money.
He did not make grand promises or sale jpgs he stepped up and funded it.  Have to research it more
looks interesting but I refuse to play games where you can be grieved when you logoff.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-01-19-why-the-people-behind-crowdfunded-camelot-unchained-wont-sell-spaceships-or-castles

mtn355

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #522 on: January 20, 2018, 01:51:38 PM »
Has anyone noticed that while everybody is talking about this lawsuit nobody is talking about the failed state of the game?

That's what this is all supposed to be about. There is NO GAME.

Oh, of course I have,
this is the single most bewildering thought i have whenever I watch SC footage:
Yeah - looks nice but - where The F is the game??!!!

I mean, ~30 min to get to be mission ready? Really?!
(Obiously CR has no children.
I just have max time for 30-60 mins to play games a day -
and there are numerous games which satisfy that.)

And it won't redefine PC gaming anymore -
the hardware specs are so out of touch with reality, it's so hilarious.
I guess nearly everyone who really wants to play this "game" has already maxed out his rig -
the rest won't bother to buy in this farce anymore.

Fun Fact:
I had a quick glance at the CIG website -
they are currently looking for a
"Lead Gameplay Programmer" in Frankfurt, Germany.
(A bit late, IMHO :D)

Another fun fact:
Just look up "most anticipated games 2018" -
look at 5 or more articles -
I didn't find SC mentioned anywhere!


Cheers,
MT

Spunky Munkee

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #523 on: January 20, 2018, 03:07:56 PM »
The citizens response to why this is not on the top most anticipated games for 2018 is that EVERYBODY knows the game will receive every bit of loving polish the master (bator) Chris (did I say fidelity?) Roberts can lavish upon it. So don't expect it before 2019 (or 2020 or...).

I don't mind. At this point these shitizens are simply digging themselves into a deeper and deeper hole. I think the ones that cannot be labeled as clearly mentally deficient have already requested refunds. The rest... who cares? But Roberts and Ortwin and Sandi deserve criminal prosecution. Ineptitude and malfeasance (even for CFO/CLO) on this level cannot be allowed to remain unpunished.

Backer42

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Re: Star Citizen Media Articles
« Reply #524 on: January 20, 2018, 07:26:46 PM »
CIGs MtD was never going to succeed but that doesn't mean they won't win.
CIG/RSI/Ortwin already lost, when they got sued by CT. A win would have been settling out of court, without the public taking notice.

If Amazon cancels their AWS (to bar CIG/RSI/CR from using LY), they are never going to find another engine vendor willing to contract them.

 

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